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T O P I C R E V I E W
rafferty
I have a lot of respect for him as a producer and dj. And I do like a lot of the tracks on Electric Fox. But I do notice he and the label gives very little support to new producers compared to a lot of the other labels out there.
His sets usually consist of productions from a small group of producers that he knows well with a few of his own remixes of well known EDM & Hardstyle producers.
I don't think it is through lack of quality. As there are new guys out there that are producing just as well as him in the UK with tracks that would work in his sets.
The smaller labels seem to be doing a great job of signing new producers. Labels like Justice Hardcore, Scarred Digital, Total Hardcore., Hardcore Underground.
Even Scott Brown is often releasing newer UK producers tracks and remixes. Mark Breeze has released a lot of new talent from the UK on Future World too.
What are your thoughts on the reasoning behind it?
Samination
I can't/shouldn't really say much since I'm not very fund of the sound, but their rendition of DJ Manga/DJ Panda's "It's a Dream" is crap. (Switch)
wong
well he's barely part of the uk scene anymore so why would he?
warped_candykid
Styles sold himself out. He's not about to showcase unknown peeps. C'mon now.
SparkzMusic
It is what it is.
An artist that was lucky enough to be there at the start of actual "happy hardcore". Who probably wasn't doing it all for the cash until after or around Clubland days.
I think the turn of the new raver baby sound was done with minimal money made, some love for the music still but he was at a point due to work with Force previously where he would only work with the so called worthy ones..... Other pretty much big names.
After the success of Clubland (and as I recall, good albums but were 95% filled with bignames), money has been the incentive. Unless someone makes something that has 500k plays or whatever, why would he even bother trying to work with them or remix it when his name sells, regardless of how good it is?
Smaller labels - Producers are sadly 10 a penny these days. Smaller labels would almost sign anyone. HU isn't a "small" label anyway. But for the others, the more artists releasing with them, the more potential publicity right?
Mark Breeze - He never made the money Styles did. He's never been a great or as popular producer. If he was then he would have done the same thing as Styles. Styles carried him, Styles went his own way (even back in the day with work like "taking me higher"). Breeze is really just using a few things he picked up from working with big names and so on to pull in new talent because he just can't do it on his own. In other words it was "Oh shit, Darren has gone. What do I do? Oh yeah, I was on clubland albums and owned Infinity back in the day, that will bring in some people to help me out".
The drunken scotsman
Nothing wrong with wanting to make as much money as possible from his undoubted talent. People seem to think that the likes of Darren Styles owe something to hardcore and demonise him for ?selling out?, when the truth is that he carried the genre for several years before heading to the US. Put it this way, in the past, Hardcore would have been a lot worse off without him. He has been responsible for more anthemic tunes than I care to remember - far more than any other single producer.
I was always a big fan of his and this type of chat has been aimed at him as long as I can remember. Quite sad really, as if he should prioritise ?the scene? over his family and career potential.
carldj90
Well he makes money doing what he loves. So who cares? It is not his responsibility to give anyone any amount of exposure.
Vladel
The only thing I wish Styles would do is release some music.
Captain Triceps
quote:Originally posted by Vladel:
The only thing I wish Styles would do is release some music.
With Force.
warped_candykid
quote:Originally posted by Captain Triceps:
quote:Originally posted by Vladel:
The only thing I wish Styles would do is release some music.
With Force.
or Breeze again
Captain Triceps
Fuck it, reform Force and The Evolution and start again
baakaara
90's "Happy hardcore" is fantastic, and if you roll back to the earlier 00's i think you'll agree that nowadays hardcore is rapidly going down the toilet.
We needs producers to produce slammers how they used to because this warpy, trappy slowed down EDM shite is killing it. With Darren's sets you never really hear him play tunes from the upciming producers or maybe the less well known dj's. he likes to play his own stuff - which is his choice.
As for Gammer, well please do not even get me started on that. Turned his back on UK hardcore, and as for the TWR debacle well - what a way to promise your loyal fans fresh frequent releases and then just pull the plug without any explanation to those who had paid their money for all their releases ? That fella really does make me sick, the thousands of fans that comment on his FB page with nice words get nothing back, but the ones who post something critical or negative he is all over like a rash.
But yes darren should share his powerhouse knowledge and expertise with upcoming producers.
SparkzMusic
quote:Originally posted by baakaara:
We needs producers to produce slammers how they used to because this warpy, trappy slowed down EDM shite is killing it.
People do make slammers like they used to be but publicity is a problem.
It takes many hours to produce a track from scratch and even more if there's lyrics to write and everything else. It's all very well doing it unpaid and for the love of the scene but even the most dedicated producer will question "what's the point?" after spending 15 hours making a track for FREE and a month later having 10 plays.
People who want to hear the old sound will typically go on YT and search for "Hixxy" or "Breeze and styles", play a few tracks and that's that until the next time.
The sound is too old to be mainstream again like it was in the clubland days and it's very hard to grow publicity of newer artists who make that sound because where do people even look for it? Typing in "UK hardcore" to YT brings up the newer sound as well as older stuff.
The only way the scene can ever be what it was with that sound is if Styles and co start making that sound again (not a chance in hell) or if enough new and old amateur/semi pro producers started a new (old) wave backed by lots of funding towards publicity (CD giveaways, events, etc), which let's be honest, won't ever happen.
Sulphurik
Yes Styles probably should support new producers more. Playing tracks from up and coming producers in his DJ sets.
quote:Originally posted by SparkzMusic:
quote:Originally posted by baakaara:
We needs producers to produce slammers how they used to because this warpy, trappy slowed down EDM shite is killing it.
People do make slammers like they used to be but publicity is a problem.
It takes many hours to produce a track from scratch and even more if there's lyrics to write and everything else. It's all very well doing it unpaid and for the love of the scene but even the most dedicated producer will question "what's the point?" after spending 15 hours making a track for FREE and a month later having 10 plays.
People who want to hear the old sound will typically go on YT and search for "Hixxy" or "Breeze and styles", play a few tracks and that's that until the next time.
The sound is too old to be mainstream again like it was in the clubland days and it's very hard to grow publicity of newer artists who make that sound because where do people even look for it? Typing in "UK hardcore" to YT brings up the newer sound as well as older stuff.
The only way the scene can ever be what it was with that sound is if Styles and co start making that sound again (not a chance in hell) or if enough new and old amateur/semi pro producers started a new (old) wave backed by lots of funding towards publicity (CD giveaways, events, etc), which let's be honest, won't ever happen.
There are some artists who are still producing the older UK Hardcore sound...Scott Brown hasn't changed his style as much as the newer EDM sound. Macks Wolf, Jonny El and M Project producing in similar way (mainstream UK style) UFO would still be producing similar to his older Raver Baby style and Al Storm in many of his tracks also.
Samination
quote:Originally posted by Sulphurik:
Yes Styles probably should support new producers more. Playing tracks from up and coming producers in his DJ sets.
quote:Originally posted by SparkzMusic:
quote:Originally posted by baakaara:
We needs producers to produce slammers how they used to because this warpy, trappy slowed down EDM shite is killing it.
People do make slammers like they used to be but publicity is a problem.
It takes many hours to produce a track from scratch and even more if there's lyrics to write and everything else. It's all very well doing it unpaid and for the love of the scene but even the most dedicated producer will question "what's the point?" after spending 15 hours making a track for FREE and a month later having 10 plays.
People who want to hear the old sound will typically go on YT and search for "Hixxy" or "Breeze and styles", play a few tracks and that's that until the next time.
The sound is too old to be mainstream again like it was in the clubland days and it's very hard to grow publicity of newer artists who make that sound because where do people even look for it? Typing in "UK hardcore" to YT brings up the newer sound as well as older stuff.
The only way the scene can ever be what it was with that sound is if Styles and co start making that sound again (not a chance in hell) or if enough new and old amateur/semi pro producers started a new (old) wave backed by lots of funding towards publicity (CD giveaways, events, etc), which let's be honest, won't ever happen.
There are some artists who are still producing the older UK Hardcore sound...Scott Brown hasn't changed his style as much as the newer EDM sound. Macks Wolf, Jonny El and M Project producing in similar way (mainstream UK style) UFO would still be producing similar to his older Raver Baby style and Al Storm in many of his tracks also.
Excluding the Hardcore Heaven album. God damn that how that one made him weak, by having the set almost sound safer than F&D's mix
trippnface
quote:Originally posted by Samination:
quote:Originally posted by Sulphurik:
Yes Styles probably should support new producers more. Playing tracks from up and coming producers in his DJ sets.
quote:Originally posted by SparkzMusic:
quote:Originally posted by baakaara:
We needs producers to produce slammers how they used to because this warpy, trappy slowed down EDM shite is killing it.
People do make slammers like they used to be but publicity is a problem.
It takes many hours to produce a track from scratch and even more if there's lyrics to write and everything else. It's all very well doing it unpaid and for the love of the scene but even the most dedicated producer will question "what's the point?" after spending 15 hours making a track for FREE and a month later having 10 plays.
People who want to hear the old sound will typically go on YT and search for "Hixxy" or "Breeze and styles", play a few tracks and that's that until the next time.
The sound is too old to be mainstream again like it was in the clubland days and it's very hard to grow publicity of newer artists who make that sound because where do people even look for it? Typing in "UK hardcore" to YT brings up the newer sound as well as older stuff.
The only way the scene can ever be what it was with that sound is if Styles and co start making that sound again (not a chance in hell) or if enough new and old amateur/semi pro producers started a new (old) wave backed by lots of funding towards publicity (CD giveaways, events, etc), which let's be honest, won't ever happen.
There are some artists who are still producing the older UK Hardcore sound...Scott Brown hasn't changed his style as much as the newer EDM sound. Macks Wolf, Jonny El and M Project producing in similar way (mainstream UK style) UFO would still be producing similar to his older Raver Baby style and Al Storm in many of his tracks also.
Excluding the Hardcore Heaven album. God damn that how that one made him weak, by having the set almost sound safer than F&D's mix
agreed, was pretty weak
CDJay
Wow. It's like a hug from Edward Scissorhands. Good luck getting a representative genre comp in future 😉
Edit: I mainly enjoy the idea of any uk hardcore mix being "safe" in the current climate. Genuinely, you'll miss it when it's gone.
CDJay
SparkzMusic
quote:Originally posted by CDJay:
Wow. It's like a hug from Edward Scissorhands. Good luck getting a representative genre comp in future 😉
Edit: I mainly enjoy the idea of any uk hardcore mix being "safe" in the current climate. Genuinely, you'll miss it when it's gone.
CDJay
CDJay. I don't mean to burst the bubble or bring down that ego but surely c'mon.
A "representative genre comp" ?
What is representative of the genre? A side that has Fracus and Darwin, or a side that has Darren Styles? Answers on a postcard please.
Why would people, in most cases miss what isn't there and what they have lived so long without?
You are someone who has done a lot for the "scene" or whatever it's called now. You worked hard and went above the call of duty, but, let's just say even though it felt like it at times and perhaps was, it's not a voluntary position at all.
If the scene is so bad and the whole HU stuff or whatever is ....and to not quote me but it was something you said recently along the lines of "holding the scene together".... why not pack it in?
It just seems as if you speak about the releases you do in such a way, that if the god, yourself, wasn't getting stuff released then nobody would have anything to listen to...ever.
When truly, I think less people care than you think. On here anyway.
CDJay
The postcard would add "Mob" and "Tecknikore", and probably a list of the different artists featured across three albums in the space of just over 12 months.
After the crap at the start of the year, we stepped back to focus on internal projects and what's happened elsewhere as the year draws to a close? Next to nothing. Why? Well, it's alluded to else where in this thread, and forum, but it's something I've been banging my head against for years: a total lack of impetus and agency at all levels. Writing and releasing music is *CRITICAL* for a scene to survive, never mind thrive.
Everyone is sitting around sort of hoping this will fix itself, but it really won't until everyone at all levels actually starts writing and releasing music and then properly showcasing it to both existing and new audiences.
I'm *far* from claiming to be God as it's very clear that I've failed. I mean, look at the state of things FFS. I think you might have confused my frustration with something else entirely.
CDJay
Vladel
quote:Originally posted by CDJay:
The postcard would add "Mob" and "Tecknikore", and probably a list of the different artists featured across three albums in the space of just over 12 months.
After the crap at the start of the year, we stepped back to focus on internal projects and what's happened elsewhere as the year draws to a close? Next to nothing. Why? Well, it's alluded to else where in this thread, and forum, but it's something I've been banging my head against for years: a total lack of impetus and agency at all levels. Writing and releasing music is *CRITICAL* for a scene to survive, never mind thrive.
Everyone is sitting around sort of hoping this will fix itself, but it really won't until everyone at all levels actually starts writing and releasing music and then properly showcasing it to both existing and new audiences.
I'm *far* from claiming to be God as it's very clear that I've failed. I mean, look at the state of things FFS. I think you might have confused my frustration with something else entirely.
CDJay
No one can knock your dedication over the years and yes, this year has been very ****in grim
trippnface
quote:Originally posted by CDJay:
Wow. It's like a hug from Edward Scissorhands. Good luck getting a representative genre comp in future 😉
Edit: I mainly enjoy the idea of any uk hardcore mix being "safe" in the current climate. Genuinely, you'll miss it when it's gone.
CDJay
I disagree with sam there, I think scott's mix was way safer than f & d's. i don't even think i liked 1 track off scott's mix, there was nothing i could identify as a scott brown sound, really. making it way too safe. atleast f& d mix did not make me forget i was listening to a hardcore mix. i see where you are coming from ,but how much general public is honestly paying attention? how much would honestly be lost just making a mix of full on bangers, and say **** the mainstream corporate sound or potential exposure? at this point, i think the " safe sound" is a lose lose.
the general public barely registers a blip, and the whiny jaded old hardcore heads just get bored. let's just go out with a bang. lol
trippnface
it's honestly the same reason i can barely be bothered to attend a hardcore rave anymore.
i refuse to wade through through hours of butchered mixes containing ******** trap/dubstep/big room/ etc sounds, just to hear a few solid vocal bangers. It's a waste of my time. The vibe is gone.
If I feel the same way about hardcore mixes.... there is no way "playing it safe" is of value for us at this stage. Perhaps it was a valiant shot ,but I don't think it is paying off.
Samination
quote:Originally posted by trippnface:
quote:Originally posted by CDJay:
Wow. It's like a hug from Edward Scissorhands. Good luck getting a representative genre comp in future 😉
Edit: I mainly enjoy the idea of any uk hardcore mix being "safe" in the current climate. Genuinely, you'll miss it when it's gone.
CDJay
I disagree with sam there, I think scott's mix was way safer than f & d's. i don't even think i liked 1 track off scott's mix, there was nothing i could identify as a scott brown sound, really. making it way too safe. atleast f& d mix did not make me forget i was listening to a hardcore mix. i see where you are coming from ,but how much general public is honestly paying attention? how much would honestly be lost just making a mix of full on bangers, and say **** the mainstream corporate sound or potential exposure? at this point, i think the " safe sound" is a lose lose.
the general public barely registers a blip, and the whiny jaded old hardcore heads just get bored. let's just go out with a bang. lol
so, you're disagreeing with me, by agreeing with me and saying it's even more safer than I said it was? :P
CDJay: Scott Browns mix contain zero gabber(ish) tracks, while F&D contained 1. You should never play more gabber than the Scotsman! :P
djDMS
It was what it needed to be. Didn't blow my pants off but was a definite representation of the music at the time (and since).
As for the 'why not release a CD full of bangers' argument.
Good luck with that! I've been gathering tunes for a mix that I'd want to listen to all the way through for months and I'm still nowhere near.
Samination
quote:Originally posted by djDMS:
It was what it needed to be. Didn't blow my pants off but was a definite representation of the music at the time (and since).
As for the 'why not release a CD full of bangers' argument.
Good luck with that! I've been gathering tunes for a mix that I'd want to listen to all the way through for months and I'm still nowhere near.
are you talking about newer tracks, or 30 years of music that you cant fill 60-80 minutes of?
djDMS
New, obviously.
I could knock out 50 CDs of old tunes without any trouble.
I know there is still good stuff out there but it's so spread out it takes a lot of finding
trippnface
quote:Originally posted by djDMS:
It was what it needed to be. Didn't blow my pants off but was a definite representation of the music at the time (and since).
As for the 'why not release a CD full of bangers' argument.
Good luck with that! I've been gathering tunes for a mix that I'd want to listen to all the way through for months and I'm still nowhere near.
good point...
trippnface
quote:Originally posted by Samination:
quote:Originally posted by trippnface:
quote:Originally posted by CDJay:
Wow. It's like a hug from Edward Scissorhands. Good luck getting a representative genre comp in future 😉
Edit: I mainly enjoy the idea of any uk hardcore mix being "safe" in the current climate. Genuinely, you'll miss it when it's gone.
CDJay
I disagree with sam there, I think scott's mix was way safer than f & d's. i don't even think i liked 1 track off scott's mix, there was nothing i could identify as a scott brown sound, really. making it way too safe. atleast f& d mix did not make me forget i was listening to a hardcore mix. i see where you are coming from ,but how much general public is honestly paying attention? how much would honestly be lost just making a mix of full on bangers, and say **** the mainstream corporate sound or potential exposure? at this point, i think the " safe sound" is a lose lose.
the general public barely registers a blip, and the whiny jaded old hardcore heads just get bored. let's just go out with a bang. lol
so, you're disagreeing with me, by agreeing with me and saying it's even more safer than I said it was? :P
CDJay: Scott Browns mix contain zero gabber(ish) tracks, while F&D contained 1. You should never play more gabber than the Scotsman! :P
k.. i'm stoned lol
rafferty
Here a is set from him last year. With all tracks from well established producers. Saying that I am surprised how big parties seem to be getting in Australia. They seem to be getting higher attendances there than even Westfest.
Darren Styles Knockout Circuz, Sydney
CDJay
Anyone 'member EDC? It was going to save it all, because Hardcore. Oh.
It's like living in Groundhog Day 2: the sequel where everyone remembers last time but expects a different outcome the trillionth time around.
CDJay
It took 1.72 ninja's to process this page!
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