There's a few ideas, overwhelming choices, anybody have personal thoughts or feedback, on these or anything else I should check out
DJ_FunDaBounce
These are all great controllers, if you have the money.
Personally I'd go for the ddj800, perhaps as it's a huge step up from the one I have (wego), yet the least expensive of the bunch. I'd even go for a ddj400 as it's got something the wego doesn't: a gain knob on the mixer channels.
essential.
trippnface
Thanks for suggestions.
ok , after more research, I see that I don't want something that needs to a labtop to function, and would like something with both cd drives & usb ports.
ideas in that spectrum?
MusicILove
I have been trying to get to reply to this but my WiFi isn?t allowing me to access the forum. On 4G now. It depends on the features you want. For players with both CD drives and USB ports your options for new equipment are.
CDJ 350 https://www.pioneerdj.com/en-gb/product/player/cdj-350/black/overview/ This was released in 2009 along with the original CDJ 2000 & CDJ 900. It?s a good basic player it has looping and a loop cutter although the loops are not using beat grids. It has a BPM lock allowing you to set the BPM of each track without using the pitch slider.
Warning about large library?s. I found this and the CDJ 850 don?t handle over 1000 tracks very well and get slow.
CDJ 850 https://www.pioneerdj.com/en-gb/product/player/cdj-850/black/overview/ This was released in 2010 in response to the complaints about the price of the CDJ 900. It was designed to look and feel like the CDJ 800MK2 and was sold at a similar price. In 2012 the black model was released and is the only new model available today. It doesn?t have BPM lock or the loop cutter but it does have its own beat loops like the CDJ 800MK2 with the ability to change the modes to access smaller loops. It has the same high resolution pitch from the higher end players unlike the CDJ 800 MK2
Also this and the CDJ 350 can't do 100% pitch modes with digital files only on CD audio. They also don?t use beat grids just the Rekordbox BPM value. They also don?t have as accurate loops as the higher end players.
Released in 2013 It?s an upgrade to the CDJ 900. It lost the tilted display of the original and high end players but has most of the features of a CDJ 2000 Nexus. It is only missing Hot Cues. Instead it has an expanded beat loop section from the CDJ 850 / Original CDJ 900. Which Allows for slip rolls.
Some advice. Try looking at a Pioneer DJ authorised store. I wouldn?t necessarily trust the prices all the support of sellers and Amazon.
I know of only one in the US which is the DJ TechTools store.
If you have any questions feel free to ask. I can also advise on mixers :)
trippnface
quote:Originally posted by MusicILove:
I have been trying to get to reply to this but my WiFi isn?t allowing me to access the forum. On 4G now. It depends on the features you want. For players with both CD drives and USB ports your options for new equipment are.
CDJ 350 https://www.pioneerdj.com/en-gb/product/player/cdj-350/black/overview/ This was released in 2009 along with the original CDJ 2000 & CDJ 900. It?s a good basic player it has looping and a loop cutter although the loops are not using beat grids. It has a BPM lock allowing you to set the BPM of each track without using the pitch slider.
Warning about large library?s. I found this and the CDJ 850 don?t handle over 1000 tracks very well and get slow.
CDJ 850 https://www.pioneerdj.com/en-gb/product/player/cdj-850/black/overview/ This was released in 2010 in response to the complaints about the price of the CDJ 900. It was designed to look and feel like the CDJ 800MK2 and was sold at a similar price. In 2012 the black model was released and is the only new model available today. It doesn?t have BPM lock or the loop cutter but it does have its own beat loops like the CDJ 800MK2 with the ability to change the modes to access smaller loops. It has the same high resolution pitch from the higher end players unlike the CDJ 800 MK2
Also this and the CDJ 350 can't do 100% pitch modes with digital files only on CD audio. They also don?t use beat grids just the Rekordbox BPM value. They also don?t have as accurate loops as the higher end players.
Released in 2013 It?s an upgrade to the CDJ 900. It lost the tilted display of the original and high end players but has most of the features of a CDJ 2000 Nexus. It is only missing Hot Cues. Instead it has an expanded beat loop section from the CDJ 850 / Original CDJ 900. Which Allows for slip rolls.
Some advice. Try looking at a Pioneer DJ authorised store. I wouldn?t necessarily trust the prices all the support of sellers and Amazon.
I know of only one in the US which is the DJ TechTools store.
If you have any questions feel free to ask. I can also advise on mixers :)
word, thanks man!
I suppose I would be willing to purchase middle of the road cdj's, i was leaning toward a controller until i learn to beat match, cuz id feel a bit ridiculous spending a couple thousand with basically zero experience or skill level lol. might be used for outdoor parties and such as well instead of a strictly home setup, and i'd prefer to not have to drag 2 seperate cdj's around & a mixer. Though I don't really want to purchase 2nd hand from someone i don't know, and all the new cdj's are expensive as hell.
Guess I will have to think on this one!
As far as mixers go, is a 4 channel really necessary? a competent dj should be able to have flawless transitions & possibly live mash up with 2 channels if he knows what he's doin, yeah?
I love the idea of that. When I saw the announcement I wanted one but the price. I feel it?s too much. I get the battery and portability but I would like to see it cheaper. Perhaps the 2nd generation will be cheaper.
MusicILove
quote:Originally posted by trippnface:
And I suppose a cd drive isn't a requirement if that opens up more/better options
If that is the case you are looking for an all in one DJ system. A controller is computer only.
This is in the same price range. It has everything you need to learn this is the lowest end system Pioneer DJ do. But it?s still very fully featured for the price. It only has 3 beat effects but it really depends on wether you like effects or if you plan to upgrade in the future when you want more. It?s still hardware so it will perform perfectly with no issues.
This is the highest end device Pioneer DJ make. It?s expensive but when you put it against the NXS2 setup price wise it?s great value.
Denon Dj have options but if you want to learn and create a music collection ready for the club one day you are best off with Pioneer DJ. You won?t find many Denon setups in clubs. Denon All In ones are popular with mobile DJs mostly.
I would always recommend buying new. Especially with what?s going on in the world. Also if you want it to last you want peace of mind that someone hasn?t already damaged it. And that your warranty will help you in the first year if you have any issues
Any of these devices will do you well and will make you very happy. I wish these options were around when I started. For that price when I started you got a CDJ 900 and that was it. :)
trippnface
thoughts on xdj 700 , personal experience or otherwise?
Def within my price range for 2, even brand new, and a reasonably priced mixer, under 2 grand.
If they suck, I would either go new with that denon mixer or the xdj rx2
trippnface
Another question, what's up with pioneer vs denon, any serious differences in price vs value?
DJ_FunDaBounce
quote:Originally posted by trippnface:
Another question, what's up with pioneer vs denon, any serious differences in price vs value?
Back in the early days of cd players, Denon was one of, if not The alternative to pioneer.
They make(made?) mixers a la pioneer too.
For some reason I don't like the new denon products, aesthetically speaking.
That stand alone unit seems like a step in the right direction, though.
MusicILove
quote:Originally posted by trippnface:
thoughts on xdj 700 , personal experience or otherwise?
Def within my price range for 2, even brand new, and a reasonably priced mixer, under 2 grand.
If they suck, I would either go new with that denon mixer or the xdj rx2
They are good but they are a generation old. I wouldn't recommend getting them for the price they are. If you get something like the XDJ RX2 you will get more features and better file support.
AWal
quote:Originally posted by trippnface:
Another question, what's up with pioneer vs denon, any serious differences in price vs value?
As of the past few years Denon has been pushing for more innovation in the market, bringing the same or more features when compared to a similarly featured Pioneer product for less money.
Requiring CD in a standalone will bring the cost up, no matter how you look at it.
looks like the Pioneer standalone mixers that aren't a modular setup have already been covered.
If you are okay with ripping ahead of time and using USBs (or for some units, a hard drive), denon has a few options:
Prime 4
Prime 2
Prime GO
MCX8000
Prime 4 is the big daddy, and gives you four channels to mix, with two internal players and two zone outputs (your master mix, and a seperate zone if you want to pipe a playlist to a different room)
Prime 2 is very similar to the Prime 4, but with a reduced feature set (notably, less mixer channels and no seperate zone output)
Prime GO is similar to the Prime 2 in more ways than would be expected, with the perk of it having a built-in rechargeable battery.
MCX8000 was the first Prime player to come to market. It's built-in playback is similar to a pair of basic modular players, but with a four track mixer that can still take outside inputs, and supports on-the-fly and hybrid switching between the built-in players, a PC, or Line/Phono-in sources.
I would say I'm not biased towards Denon, but I've had this MCX8000 for a while now, which doesn't help....Also AMA if you can't find something out about the MCX8000.
trippnface
quote:Originally posted by AWal:
quote:Originally posted by trippnface:
Another question, what's up with pioneer vs denon, any serious differences in price vs value?
As of the past few years Denon has been pushing for more innovation in the market, bringing the same or more features when compared to a similarly featured Pioneer product for less money.
Requiring CD in a standalone will bring the cost up, no matter how you look at it.
looks like the Pioneer standalone mixers that aren't a modular setup have already been covered.
If you are okay with ripping ahead of time and using USBs (or for some units, a hard drive), denon has a few options:
Prime 4
Prime 2
Prime GO
MCX8000
Prime 4 is the big daddy, and gives you four channels to mix, with two internal players and two zone outputs (your master mix, and a seperate zone if you want to pipe a playlist to a different room)
Prime 2 is very similar to the Prime 4, but with a reduced feature set (notably, less mixer channels and no seperate zone output)
Prime GO is similar to the Prime 2 in more ways than would be expected, with the perk of it having a built-in rechargeable battery.
MCX8000 was the first Prime player to come to market. It's built-in playback is similar to a pair of basic modular players, but with a four track mixer that can still take outside inputs, and supports on-the-fly and hybrid switching between the built-in players, a PC, or Line/Phono-in sources.
I would say I'm not biased towards Denon, but I've had this MCX8000 for a while now, which doesn't help....Also AMA if you can't find something out about the MCX8000.
haha right on man, ty!
MusicILove
quote:Originally posted by trippnface:
Another question, what's up with pioneer vs denon, any serious differences in price vs value?
Pioneer DJ is what you will find in every club. Pioneer DJ have been on top for decades now. Denon is trying to break through but they aren't doing a very good job. They are cheaper yes but they also have their downfalls.
The main one with Denon DJ is their software. Engine Prime is really lacking in comparison to Rekordbox. The most important thing with these modern devices is to get your music sorted and analysed in the software. Then export to a USB. A lot of features require the software to analyse them to work correctly.
When you start working on a collection you don't want to change. You will spend hours, days, weeks, months or years working on this. Depending on how much music you have. If you go with Pioneer DJ and work in Rekordbox when you go to a club or a friends house chances are they will have a Pioneer setup so you can plug straight in.
If you show up with a Pioneer stick to a Denon setup it will also work although the player will have to re analyse your music and will create it's own data base. This won't effect your pioneer collection. Whereas if you put a Denon stick in a Pioneer setup it will only see the music files. Any tags, album art, BPM values, hot cues, Beat grids, and playlists won't show up. it will only display the folder structure.
Pioneer is the industry standard and I am very happy with them. I know the reviewers say how much they love the Denon equipment but they say everything is wonderful. They said the DDJ SZ was so close to a CDJ / DJM setup and it was one of the worst things I owned.
My advice stick to Pioneer.
MusicILove
quote:Originally posted by AWal:
quote:Originally posted by trippnface:
Another question, what's up with pioneer vs denon, any serious differences in price vs value?
As of the past few years Denon has been pushing for more innovation in the market, bringing the same or more features when compared to a similarly featured Pioneer product for less money.
Requiring CD in a standalone will bring the cost up, no matter how you look at it.
looks like the Pioneer standalone mixers that aren't a modular setup have already been covered.
If you are okay with ripping ahead of time and using USBs (or for some units, a hard drive), denon has a few options:
Prime 4
Prime 2
Prime GO
MCX8000
Prime 4 is the big daddy, and gives you four channels to mix, with two internal players and two zone outputs (your master mix, and a seperate zone if you want to pipe a playlist to a different room)
Prime 2 is very similar to the Prime 4, but with a reduced feature set (notably, less mixer channels and no seperate zone output)
Prime GO is similar to the Prime 2 in more ways than would be expected, with the perk of it having a built-in rechargeable battery.
MCX8000 was the first Prime player to come to market. It's built-in playback is similar to a pair of basic modular players, but with a four track mixer that can still take outside inputs, and supports on-the-fly and hybrid switching between the built-in players, a PC, or Line/Phono-in sources.
I would say I'm not biased towards Denon, but I've had this MCX8000 for a while now, which doesn't help....Also AMA if you can't find something out about the MCX8000.
I agree that Denon have been pushing innovation more than Pioneer. But I feel stability and compatibility are more important. I think the Denon all in ones are better for mobile DJs though. They seem to be aiming for that market.
Pioneer XDJ XZ for a mobile DJ isn't as good as the prime 4. But for playing Hardcore for home and small party use I feel Pioneer have the better options. Yes they are out of date feature wise but they are stable and compatible with everything in their range. Which you are more likely to come in to contact with.
Guest
easily the RX, because i have one i haven't used for 2 years
the mapping has been made with traktor v2.8.0, all the buttons on the DDJ-RX console will work as the label says, with 4 decks, 4 FX units and 4 Remix decks, the only changes are as follows :
browser back button = scroll down tree list browser tag button = scroll up tree list browser knob button push = expand tree list mixer channel FX 1 & 2 = will load next/previous track in browser slip/vinyl button = will switch between track and remix deck mode on deck layers 1,2,3,4 grid adjust button = will increase the slicers, freezemode steps to match the number of pads grid slide button = will decrease the slicers, freezemode steps shift + FX unit knob = select FX when Fx unit is in group mode shift + needle touch strip = zoom in on waveform
the only "bug" is when you first power on or load traktor, you will need to press deck layer buttons 1 & 2 to enable a modifier which will allow the FX units to work, along with FX units 3 & 4 for decks C & D
I also have'nt included any pad FX
when a remix deck is being used, you will need the sampler pads, which only play 2 samples on each slot of a deck
Guest
rekordbox is the biggest sack of shit you could use
MusicILove
Oh look the machine is back :)
Guest
denon might get some balls, and give the inventor a pair this time
i'll use every button and function in the first 30 minutes like everyday for the past 9 years
Dem Retak
I got the Prime 4 as my first controller. I had an opportunity to get myself familiar with mixing on the nexus 2 setup by pioneer and also sorted my tracks in rekordbox back then.
While being a newb at that point definitely played a role, I always found the nexus2 a bit confusing and complicated. I guess that workflow just wasn't for me. Also in terms of value, I just couldn't accept the fact that the equipment feels outdated while being priced like it just came out last year.
The Denons workflow is really straight forward and clean. I can focus more on creative ideas, the storyline of my mix and if at any point I want to mix in a track that popped in my head, then that requires only one touch and takes just a second to type the name in the search. The touch screen is as responsive as you'd expect from any modern flagship phone or tablet. No lag or weird stuff at all. The same process on the CDJ feels like using an early smartphone where it takes more effort and isn't as straight forward. You can really feel the age gap in the technology.
On the hardware side the controller feels like it could take a beating, the only exception being the screen, which protrudes and could be damaged in transport if not using a proper case. The finish feels really good and the face plate is metal. There is a little wiggle in a couple of the knobs but that's only noticed if you try to wiggle them on purpose. The platters feel amazingly smooth, especially compared to the CDJ's where there is this plastic on plastic type of rub felt especially badly on used players. The Prime 4 does lack however the mechanical adjustment of the platters(can adjust sensitivity in software). The effect sections are brilliant, very easy to use and you can set up 2 separate effects at the same time(although you can't use both at the same time on the same channel).
On the software side, the Engine OS (firmware on the hardware) is surprisingly responsive and intuitive. This makes it feel like you really are only held back by your own creativity and once you have an idea, there is close to no effort made in implementing it. The very responsive and quite big screen makes browsing tracks as easy as it could be. The screen itself has pretty high resolution too, no pixels can be seen on the screen. This always bothered me on the CDJ-s.
The Engine Prime, the Denons equivalent of Rekordbox, is surely in it's early stage but as of now It's only really lacking just a couple of features I'd wish were there. I have prepared my whole collection of about 1500 tracks, all of which are neatly organized, rated, tagged and beatgrid adjusted if necessary. In terms of managing my collection, I OCD like a b'tch and everything has to be as neatly and effectively organized as possible. I created a folder hierarchy where tracks are sorted by genre, subgenre, vibe and sometimes the subgenres are even split into sub-subgenres. One thing I absolutely love is that folders also act as playlists in the Denon's ecosystem. This means that if I open my hardcore folder I can use it as a playlist on it's own but if I'd fancy some dark freeform then I can just tap the hardcore folder and tap on freeform, tap on dark and get all dark freeform I have. Very easy and straight forward.
The Engine Prime is a perfectly fine piece of software, my track management wasn't made more difficult by the software than it would have been in Rekordbox. Since I couldn't use folders as playlists on Rekordbox, I'd say in my case it would have been even a bit more cumbersome in Rekordbox as I'd have to create separate playlists that include all the contents of the folders.
The best part of owning Prime 4 is feeling like I'm truly appreciated as a consumer of their products. They are releasing firmware updates often enough, which btw include additional features(we got streaming over wifi for example) not just minor tweaks. Denon's staff is very responsive on the forum and I feel like my feedback and suggestions are taken seriously. I'm also taking part in their beta testing and I can tell they are working hard, building on what their customers want. I truly feel like I put my money in the right place. I got it for 1700 moneys when it came out and felt like a bargain.
Hardware feels premium, firmware and workflow is super intuitive, updates which bring new features, the innovation and the connection with the Denon's staff all make it out to be an experience where you are pretty damn happy that you spent as much as you did on a Denon.
Engine Prime is the weakest link here but, once again, updates and their constant commitment on it improves it quite a bit and it didn't give me any real trouble as is.
Oh and I don't even need an usb! All my tracks are on an internal 500gb SSD. Every track loads in a blink of an eye and I can't lose anything!
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