trippnface Advanced Member
United States
1,654 posts Joined: Jan, 2010
Posted - 2020/03/31 : 07:38:06
quote:Originally posted by AWal:
quote:Originally posted by trippnface:
Another question, what's up with pioneer vs denon, any serious differences in price vs value?
As of the past few years Denon has been pushing for more innovation in the market, bringing the same or more features when compared to a similarly featured Pioneer product for less money.
Requiring CD in a standalone will bring the cost up, no matter how you look at it.
looks like the Pioneer standalone mixers that aren't a modular setup have already been covered.
If you are okay with ripping ahead of time and using USBs (or for some units, a hard drive), denon has a few options:
Prime 4
Prime 2
Prime GO
MCX8000
Prime 4 is the big daddy, and gives you four channels to mix, with two internal players and two zone outputs (your master mix, and a seperate zone if you want to pipe a playlist to a different room)
Prime 2 is very similar to the Prime 4, but with a reduced feature set (notably, less mixer channels and no seperate zone output)
Prime GO is similar to the Prime 2 in more ways than would be expected, with the perk of it having a built-in rechargeable battery.
MCX8000 was the first Prime player to come to market. It's built-in playback is similar to a pair of basic modular players, but with a four track mixer that can still take outside inputs, and supports on-the-fly and hybrid switching between the built-in players, a PC, or Line/Phono-in sources.
I would say I'm not biased towards Denon, but I've had this MCX8000 for a while now, which doesn't help....Also AMA if you can't find something out about the MCX8000.
MusicILove Advanced Member
United Kingdom
1,255 posts Joined: Mar, 2019
Posted - 2020/03/31 : 07:43:30
quote:Originally posted by trippnface:
Another question, what's up with pioneer vs denon, any serious differences in price vs value?
Pioneer DJ is what you will find in every club. Pioneer DJ have been on top for decades now. Denon is trying to break through but they aren't doing a very good job. They are cheaper yes but they also have their downfalls.
The main one with Denon DJ is their software. Engine Prime is really lacking in comparison to Rekordbox. The most important thing with these modern devices is to get your music sorted and analysed in the software. Then export to a USB. A lot of features require the software to analyse them to work correctly.
When you start working on a collection you don't want to change. You will spend hours, days, weeks, months or years working on this. Depending on how much music you have. If you go with Pioneer DJ and work in Rekordbox when you go to a club or a friends house chances are they will have a Pioneer setup so you can plug straight in.
If you show up with a Pioneer stick to a Denon setup it will also work although the player will have to re analyse your music and will create it's own data base. This won't effect your pioneer collection. Whereas if you put a Denon stick in a Pioneer setup it will only see the music files. Any tags, album art, BPM values, hot cues, Beat grids, and playlists won't show up. it will only display the folder structure.
Pioneer is the industry standard and I am very happy with them. I know the reviewers say how much they love the Denon equipment but they say everything is wonderful. They said the DDJ SZ was so close to a CDJ / DJM setup and it was one of the worst things I owned.
Alert moderatorEdited by - MusicILove on 2020/03/31 07:47:36
MusicILove Advanced Member
United Kingdom
1,255 posts Joined: Mar, 2019
Posted - 2020/03/31 : 07:53:20
quote:Originally posted by AWal:
quote:Originally posted by trippnface:
Another question, what's up with pioneer vs denon, any serious differences in price vs value?
As of the past few years Denon has been pushing for more innovation in the market, bringing the same or more features when compared to a similarly featured Pioneer product for less money.
Requiring CD in a standalone will bring the cost up, no matter how you look at it.
looks like the Pioneer standalone mixers that aren't a modular setup have already been covered.
If you are okay with ripping ahead of time and using USBs (or for some units, a hard drive), denon has a few options:
Prime 4
Prime 2
Prime GO
MCX8000
Prime 4 is the big daddy, and gives you four channels to mix, with two internal players and two zone outputs (your master mix, and a seperate zone if you want to pipe a playlist to a different room)
Prime 2 is very similar to the Prime 4, but with a reduced feature set (notably, less mixer channels and no seperate zone output)
Prime GO is similar to the Prime 2 in more ways than would be expected, with the perk of it having a built-in rechargeable battery.
MCX8000 was the first Prime player to come to market. It's built-in playback is similar to a pair of basic modular players, but with a four track mixer that can still take outside inputs, and supports on-the-fly and hybrid switching between the built-in players, a PC, or Line/Phono-in sources.
I would say I'm not biased towards Denon, but I've had this MCX8000 for a while now, which doesn't help....Also AMA if you can't find something out about the MCX8000.
I agree that Denon have been pushing innovation more than Pioneer. But I feel stability and compatibility are more important. I think the Denon all in ones are better for mobile DJs though. They seem to be aiming for that market.
Pioneer XDJ XZ for a mobile DJ isn't as good as the prime 4. But for playing Hardcore for home and small party use I feel Pioneer have the better options. Yes they are out of date feature wise but they are stable and compatible with everything in their range. Which you are more likely to come in to contact with.
the mapping has been made with traktor v2.8.0, all the buttons on the DDJ-RX console will work as the label says, with 4 decks, 4 FX units and 4 Remix decks, the only changes are as follows :
browser back button = scroll down tree list browser tag button = scroll up tree list browser knob button push = expand tree list mixer channel FX 1 & 2 = will load next/previous track in browser slip/vinyl button = will switch between track and remix deck mode on deck layers 1,2,3,4 grid adjust button = will increase the slicers, freezemode steps to match the number of pads grid slide button = will decrease the slicers, freezemode steps shift + FX unit knob = select FX when Fx unit is in group mode shift + needle touch strip = zoom in on waveform
the only "bug" is when you first power on or load traktor, you will need to press deck layer buttons 1 & 2 to enable a modifier which will allow the FX units to work, along with FX units 3 & 4 for decks C & D
I also have'nt included any pad FX
when a remix deck is being used, you will need the sampler pads, which only play 2 samples on each slot of a deck
__________________________________ youtube channel / soundcloud and mixcloud suck
Dem Retak New Member
Estonia
21 posts Joined: Apr, 2020
Posted - 2020/04/15 : 00:13:26
I got the Prime 4 as my first controller. I had an opportunity to get myself familiar with mixing on the nexus 2 setup by pioneer and also sorted my tracks in rekordbox back then.
While being a newb at that point definitely played a role, I always found the nexus2 a bit confusing and complicated. I guess that workflow just wasn't for me. Also in terms of value, I just couldn't accept the fact that the equipment feels outdated while being priced like it just came out last year.
The Denons workflow is really straight forward and clean. I can focus more on creative ideas, the storyline of my mix and if at any point I want to mix in a track that popped in my head, then that requires only one touch and takes just a second to type the name in the search. The touch screen is as responsive as you'd expect from any modern flagship phone or tablet. No lag or weird stuff at all. The same process on the CDJ feels like using an early smartphone where it takes more effort and isn't as straight forward. You can really feel the age gap in the technology.
On the hardware side the controller feels like it could take a beating, the only exception being the screen, which protrudes and could be damaged in transport if not using a proper case. The finish feels really good and the face plate is metal. There is a little wiggle in a couple of the knobs but that's only noticed if you try to wiggle them on purpose. The platters feel amazingly smooth, especially compared to the CDJ's where there is this plastic on plastic type of rub felt especially badly on used players. The Prime 4 does lack however the mechanical adjustment of the platters(can adjust sensitivity in software). The effect sections are brilliant, very easy to use and you can set up 2 separate effects at the same time(although you can't use both at the same time on the same channel).
On the software side, the Engine OS (firmware on the hardware) is surprisingly responsive and intuitive. This makes it feel like you really are only held back by your own creativity and once you have an idea, there is close to no effort made in implementing it. The very responsive and quite big screen makes browsing tracks as easy as it could be. The screen itself has pretty high resolution too, no pixels can be seen on the screen. This always bothered me on the CDJ-s.
The Engine Prime, the Denons equivalent of Rekordbox, is surely in it's early stage but as of now It's only really lacking just a couple of features I'd wish were there. I have prepared my whole collection of about 1500 tracks, all of which are neatly organized, rated, tagged and beatgrid adjusted if necessary. In terms of managing my collection, I OCD like a b'tch and everything has to be as neatly and effectively organized as possible. I created a folder hierarchy where tracks are sorted by genre, subgenre, vibe and sometimes the subgenres are even split into sub-subgenres. One thing I absolutely love is that folders also act as playlists in the Denon's ecosystem. This means that if I open my hardcore folder I can use it as a playlist on it's own but if I'd fancy some dark freeform then I can just tap the hardcore folder and tap on freeform, tap on dark and get all dark freeform I have. Very easy and straight forward.
The Engine Prime is a perfectly fine piece of software, my track management wasn't made more difficult by the software than it would have been in Rekordbox. Since I couldn't use folders as playlists on Rekordbox, I'd say in my case it would have been even a bit more cumbersome in Rekordbox as I'd have to create separate playlists that include all the contents of the folders.
The best part of owning Prime 4 is feeling like I'm truly appreciated as a consumer of their products. They are releasing firmware updates often enough, which btw include additional features(we got streaming over wifi for example) not just minor tweaks. Denon's staff is very responsive on the forum and I feel like my feedback and suggestions are taken seriously. I'm also taking part in their beta testing and I can tell they are working hard, building on what their customers want. I truly feel like I put my money in the right place. I got it for 1700 moneys when it came out and felt like a bargain.
Hardware feels premium, firmware and workflow is super intuitive, updates which bring new features, the innovation and the connection with the Denon's staff all make it out to be an experience where you are pretty damn happy that you spent as much as you did on a Denon.
Engine Prime is the weakest link here but, once again, updates and their constant commitment on it improves it quite a bit and it didn't give me any real trouble as is.
Oh and I don't even need an usb! All my tracks are on an internal 500gb SSD. Every track loads in a blink of an eye and I can't lose anything!
Controller question
Printer friendly
Posted - 2020/03/31 : 07:38:06
