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T O P I C R E V I E W
Mental_Adam
that hardcore possibly in the next 1 to 3 years will have another popularity push?
I feel the last major push was obviously around the late 2000's, where obviously the only compilation in the public eye was the "Clubland" series of hardcore.
However i know a lot of the posters on here are more regular than i am.
I just had a reminder of hardcore today from going to a carboot sale and picking up some 90s dutch hardcore cds and coming across a helter skelter united in hardcore box from about 2006/2007.
I do appreciate hardcore, but don't even hear the slight whisper about the current state of it. Is everything cool? I just have that gut feeling hopefully it will be electric again
arpz
No, it's completely ****ed. Events getting canned left right & centre
djDMS
I believe the official term is 'on it's arse'.
warped_candykid
I don't know what's going on with UK Hardcore now. You look on Juno, and there are tracks 120-140 bpm being labeled as UK Hardcore now. I definitely find myself buying more mid-2000s tracks than current tracks (I still try to find some new stuff I like, but it's becoming harder and harder).
DJIntensity
The scene is not the same as it was 10 years ago.
Elipton
I think the conventional Hardcore industry is under attack, but it's not clear where from.
There are a great deal of tracks that do seriously well. Synthion is a producer doing well out of his own releases. I think the selling platform for the last decade through Beatport and Juno is tired, and unviable.
Monstercat is proof that there's life in the style of music, but the genre is self-contained and cannibalistic. I'm trying hard to break that barrier and release music my way to a new audience, and i'm finding it a successful venture. But there is a way,and a new formula to it all that will help the genre push forward. However,in the last 18 months,the genre has lost 2 big envoys in DS and gammer.
trippnface
I think it's done for.
Kniteforce and other guys doing old skool is the future imo
America really helped to ruin things honestly.
Nobody ever spoke/speaks up when the sound started drastically shifting.
Seriously suprised how many fan boys still scream over people like styles, just because it's styles. it's like they are too stupid or flat out don't care it sounds nothing like it should. When the artists stop caring, and the fans stop caring, that's it.
SparkzMusic
The scene is well and truly finished. The problems stem back from many years ago.
A lot of people spoke up when the sound started changing but they were often accused of moaning.
Unfortunately what seems to have happened is dubcore caused a divide. A lot, if not most loyal hardcore fans hated it. A new wave of fans came in though who just like the dubstep elements of it.
Look at Pendulum for example. Drum and Bass/Jungle was a scene hated by many rockers and metalheads. Pendulum came about with a twist on it, threw in some guitars and rockers/metalheads were all over it. I have seen videos and heard people say they are "moshing" to Pendulum.
Anyway, they were never true, dedicated fans of drum and bass. It was just some of the elements they liked.
That's what's happened to core. The sound change pissed off most of the loyal fan base that would have bought all the albums and gone to all the events. In came a new wave of temporary fans who might go and see Darren Styles or Gammer but the rest of the time listen to and spend their money on Trap/Dubstep/Garage.
Scenes like Hardcore need structure. A bunch of bignames at the top bringing the crowds in, defining the sound. Then tiers lower down of producers who are also making that sound/adding their own twist to it.
When you have supposed big names like Gammer calling pish "happy hardcore" to make money from the American crowds, what hope is there for any structure or defined sound?
EK
Yeah I've had this same feeling about hardcore gaining some speed since the beginning of 2017, at least in North America, especially the US. I feel like we've had a flux of new promoters and artists in the states recently.
Sulphurik
DJ Seduction has released some new tracks. If you liked his early tracks, then you'll like these. Breakbeat hardcore isn't my favourite hardcore style but do like some and liked Seduction's mid 90s breakbeat tracks.
I think there are so many factors playing against it that I don't think a popular re-surge like we had in the past is possible.
It appears that the original audience have all buggered off because the recipe changed too much and not enough were taken on to keep the current sound in the realms of rammed clubs.
I get the feeling that the active ravers in the UK are mostly either DJs, MCs or Producers.
In general, publically, there's very little 'genre loyalty' nowadays, and music fans are spread across the world with no real cohesion, listening to whatever they fancy, no longer tied by money to CD compilations or albums, listening to whatever suits their mood from a vast array of genres, mostly free and from the comfort of their/their mates homes.
From where I'm sitting there's little hope for any genre to gain popular ground like it used to.
Individual artists can rise up and gain popularity make good music, spread widely under NCS/NoCopyrightSounds on youtube, an army of youtubers using YOUR song as their intro or background music...continue on the "free" bandwagon and get your track in a popular level on Roblox....or other freebie game that shit tons of kids play.
Synth/Dream/Vapourwave all gained popularity after the marketing companies lost power to the internet, and I would say that is the kind of popularity that hardcore can *hope* for. Nothing more. That's not so bad, really.
Personally, for me things went sour pretty quick around about 2006 when the nu-skool happy sound started to dry up, which coincided with practically everybody being able to make hardcore cheep and easy on cracked FLstudio. Freeform survived for a good while longer but then eventually just succumbed to precision engineered face melting THOK duh duh THOK duh duh; which is fine if you want that, but if your taste in freeform is more embedded in the rather more laid back freeform of the 90s... 'Tekno Dred - More Understanding' stuff then even the guys into freeform get pushed away.
I know i've digressed a bit there, but I fancied warbling. I think a lot of new hardcore would be a hell of a lot more palatable to me (and maybe others?) out there if it wasn't so fatiguing.
Designing and releasing music for a club enviroment; but the club is pulling 50-60 people. Audience has clearly changed so perhaps it's time to design and release for home use and stop worrying what the other genres are doing :P
Wasn't it Jeremy Corbyn who wanted a kinder, gentler hardcore? I'm sure it was.
Samination
quote:Originally posted by Sulphurik:
DJ Seduction has released some new tracks. If you liked his early tracks, then you'll like these. Breakbeat hardcore isn't my favourite hardcore style but do like some and liked Seduction's mid 90s breakbeat tracks.
Sedder's back to his old money grabbing antics. People might like his music, but no one seem to like the person.
djscavenger
Aside from the Hardcore a Underground crew and the occasional Scott Brown track very little takes my interest music wise. I don't think the scene ever recovered from the loss of big labels that underpinned the music such as Quosh, Next Generation, Essental Platinum and Raver Baby along with the associated artists.
It's different Than the 2000 situation where Hixxy & co dragged it back from the abyss. The old boys who founded the scene don't have that drive or creativity to do it again. In fairness it should be the new talent coming through to revitalise it but it's just not happened. Too many fruity loops producers knocking out cheap imitations of what was popular five years ago proving that anyone can make music but not everyone should.
As for the likes of Gammer and Styles they've gone to the states where Gammers brand of derpcore seems to be going down well. Personally I hate Gammers new style and it certainly not what got me into the music in the early years. Music is also far more disposable as well meaning compilations have dried up in favour of people making their own playlists. Add to this the fact so many clubs and venues are closing its a perfect storm.
It's sad to say this but it feels like the beggining of the end rather than the end of the beggining.
DjCirrus
quote:Originally posted by warped_candykid:
I don't know what's going on with UK Hardcore now. You look on Juno, and there are tracks 120-140 bpm being labeled as UK Hardcore now. I definitely find myself buying more mid-2000s tracks than current tracks (I still try to find some new stuff I like, but it's becoming harder and harder).
I know right! I just got into hardcore a year ago and I'd hate to see it die
Smoogie
It is all about Hard House these days. So much new talent coming through and some seriously big releases. This is what UK Hardcore could be doing but is not doing so.
One thing that sets Hard House and Hardcore apart? In Hard House new producers re able to make a breakthrough and add something to the scene along side of the older guys.
In UK Hardcore new producers where snubbed by the higher ups who have since abandoned the scene themselves
Here are some of my mixes for an example of what is out there:
The last of my former series
The start of my new series
Smoogie
quote:Originally posted by Triquatra:
Wasn't it Jeremy Corbyn who wanted a kinder, gentler hardcore? I'm sure it was.
Did someone say Corbyn? What is he doing being mentioned on here?
Well Corbyn wants all of his followers to listen to Dubstep/EDM/Trap while Theresa May supports the Strong and Stable Hard House scene.
Triquatra
Mmm yes, I suppose any genre that is on its arse, going neither up nor down could certainly be described as stable. Hardcore and Hard House are the most stable they've been in decades ;)
djDMS
quote:Originally posted by Smoogie:
It is all about Hard House these days.
Here are some of my mixes for an example of what is out there:
*Links to shit mixes removed for quality control purposes*
Oh please shut up you deluded fool!
Hard house is no better off than Hardcore at all.
If you weren't so busy trolling you'd notice that they're both going in pretty much the exact same direction.
At one end, loads of classics events. At the other end, lots of nights struggling for numbers. No new breakthrough sound etc etc.
Do your homework kid.
Smoogie
quote:Originally posted by djDMS:
quote:Originally posted by Smoogie:
It is all about Hard House these days.
Here are some of my mixes for an example of what is out there:
*Links to shit mixes removed for quality control purposes*
Oh please shut up you deluded fool!
Hard house is no better off than Hardcore at all.
If you weren't so busy trolling you'd notice that they're both going in pretty much the exact same direction.
At one end, loads of classics events. At the other end, lots of nights struggling for numbers. No new breakthrough sound etc etc.
Do your homework kid.
Funny I heard that there is a new wave of Hard House events coming up but when it comes to the music there is much more stronger releases coming out of Hard House!
Vladel
quote:Originally posted by Smoogie:
quote:Originally posted by djDMS:
quote:Originally posted by Smoogie:
It is all about Hard House these days.
Here are some of my mixes for an example of what is out there:
*Links to shit mixes removed for quality control purposes*
Oh please shut up you deluded fool!
Hard house is no better off than Hardcore at all.
If you weren't so busy trolling you'd notice that they're both going in pretty much the exact same direction.
At one end, loads of classics events. At the other end, lots of nights struggling for numbers. No new breakthrough sound etc etc.
Do your homework kid.
Funny I heard that there is a new wave of Hard House events coming up but when it comes to the music there is much more stronger releases coming out of Hard House!
You are literally the only person I know that talks about hard house
djDMS
What you mean to say is 'I don't like new Hardcore, I much prefer hard house'.
Sorted.
Now off you trot to a Hard house forum, if you can find one.
Smoogie
quote:Originally posted by djDMS:
What you mean to say is 'I don't like new Hardcore, I much prefer hard house'.
Sorted.
Now off you trot to a Hard house forum, if you can find one.
I am on a few Hard House pages on Facebook. Always busy especially if there is a livestream up.
Mansy
Smoogie your like a ****in dipshit who complains about how much you hate mc donalds and constantly talk about KFC yet sit and mc donalds all day long with your cock dipped in a KFC bucket and 1 finger in your tail pipe! Dont like hardcore....**** off simple as that! Why you hang around here like some cock infested rat is beyond me.
CDJay
I think people might be confused between "UK Hardcore" being dead, and the idea of ex UK Hardcore DJs being paid over the odds then turning up to play old music in a disinterested fashion (to people who frankly should have demanded better well before now) being a dying model.
Even I now doubt that as a "scene" it will get anywhere near where it has, in years past, but pockets of interested producers/djs/promoters will emerge and hopefully carry the torch.
IMNSHO, natch.
CDJay
Smoogie
quote:Originally posted by Mansy:
Smoogie your like a ****in dipshit who complains about how much you hate mc donalds and constantly talk about KFC yet sit and mc donalds all day long with your cock dipped in a KFC bucket and 1 finger in your tail pipe! Dont like hardcore....**** off simple as that! Why you hang around here like some cock infested rat is beyond me.
And your comment was really necessary?
djDMS
quote:Originally posted by Smoogie:
quote:Originally posted by Mansy:
Smoogie your like a ****in dipshit who complains about how much you hate mc donalds and constantly talk about KFC yet sit and mc donalds all day long with your cock dipped in a KFC bucket and 1 finger in your tail pipe! Dont like hardcore....**** off simple as that! Why you hang around here like some cock infested rat is beyond me.
And your comment was really necessary?
Much more blunt, but no less necessary than 90% of yours.
You know you're trolling.
You know you're trying to get a reaction from others.
Don't be surprised when it happens.
Smoogie
quote:Originally posted by djDMS:
quote:Originally posted by Smoogie:
quote:Originally posted by Mansy:
Smoogie your like a ****in dipshit who complains about how much you hate mc donalds and constantly talk about KFC yet sit and mc donalds all day long with your cock dipped in a KFC bucket and 1 finger in your tail pipe! Dont like hardcore....**** off simple as that! Why you hang around here like some cock infested rat is beyond me.
And your comment was really necessary?
Much more blunt, but no less necessary than 90% of yours.
You know you're trolling.
You know you're trying to get a reaction from others.
Don't be surprised when it happens.
Just talking about music as it happens
Mansy
Theres a difference between talking about it and slating a type of music in a fourm thats dedicated to a genre that you so obviously hate! Go discuss hard house in the other genre section not that you would get much attention in their about it, just like you aint in here. The topic states Hardcore FFS. I wouldnt (and im sure its obvious that no one else would) walk into a heavy metal gig and spend my whole time there saying how shit it is and that EDM is so much better 'YET' refuse to leave and still disrespect the people who do like heavy metal. The fact you dont see this shows how deluded you are!
Smoogie
quote:Originally posted by Mansy:
Theres a difference between talking about it and slating a type of music in a fourm thats dedicated to a genre that you so obviously hate! Go discuss hard house in the other genre section not that you would get much attention in their about it, just like you aint in here. The topic states Hardcore FFS. I wouldnt (and im sure its obvious that no one else would) walk into a heavy metal gig and spend my whole time there saying how shit it is and that EDM is so much better 'YET' refuse to leave and still disrespect the people who do like heavy metal. The fact you dont see this shows how deluded you are!
So who here is not slating Hardcore then? As all I ever see around here is 'Hardcore aint what it used to be' and people slagging off DJs all the time
djDMS
The operative word being HARDCORE
In a forum titled Music Discussion - HARDCORE
Where people discuss.....wait for it.....
Smoogie
quote:Originally posted by djDMS:
The operative word being HARDCORE
In a forum titled Music Discussion - HARDCORE
Where people discuss.....wait for it.....
Well you mentioned that both Hardcore and Hard House have not evolved in 15 years?
Well my latest mix starts with some obvious 2000s Hard House beginning in 2008 and then ending wit some recent stuff. Hard House is evolving while staying close to it's routes. Hardcore couldn't be any further away from what it was 2BH
djDMS
I don't care.
Seriously, I'm done with your shit. You've had enough opportunity to pack it in with the irrelevant/spam/trolling garbage.
I'm reporting every one of your posts without until somebody does something about you.
Smoogie
quote:Originally posted by djDMS:
I don't care.
Seriously, I'm done with your shit. You've had enough opportunity to pack it in with the irrelevant/spam/trolling garbage.
I'm reporting every one of your posts without until somebody does something about you.
Mansy
quote:Originally posted by djDMS:
I don't care.
Seriously, I'm done with your shit. You've had enough opportunity to pack it in with the irrelevant/spam/trolling garbage.
I'm reporting every one of your posts without until somebody does something about you.
The sad twat will only make another account and continue to do his ******** hard house propaganda!
Smoogie
quote:Originally posted by Mansy:
quote:Originally posted by djDMS:
I don't care.
Seriously, I'm done with your shit. You've had enough opportunity to pack it in with the irrelevant/spam/trolling garbage.
I'm reporting every one of your posts without until somebody does something about you.
The sad twat will only make another account and continue to do his ******** hard house propaganda!
So we use personal insults now then?
arpz
quote:Originally posted by Smoogie:
quote:Originally posted by Mansy:
quote:Originally posted by djDMS:
I don't care.
Seriously, I'm done with your shit. You've had enough opportunity to pack it in with the irrelevant/spam/trolling garbage.
I'm reporting every one of your posts without until somebody does something about you.
The sad twat will only make another account and continue to do his ******** hard house propaganda!
So we use personal insults now then?
It's not like you haven't been told politely. Not a single person has responded well to your shit so why not just **** off to a forum that would actually engage with you about it?
GrahamC
quote:Originally posted by arpz:
quote:Originally posted by Smoogie:
quote:Originally posted by Mansy:
quote:Originally posted by djDMS:
I don't care.
Seriously, I'm done with your shit. You've had enough opportunity to pack it in with the irrelevant/spam/trolling garbage.
I'm reporting every one of your posts without until somebody does something about you.
The sad twat will only make another account and continue to do his ******** hard house propaganda!
So we use personal insults now then?
It's not like you haven't been told politely. Not a single person has responded well to your shit so why not just **** off to a forum that would actually engage with you about it?
Smoogie, go and pi55 off elsewhere you c0ck womble, nobody wants you here talking about hard kicks and hard house. Pi55 off and find some real friends instead of annoying us.
Your are a cu nt of the first degree
Smoogie
quote:Originally posted by arpz:
It's not like you haven't been told politely. Not a single person has responded well to your shit so why not just **** off to a forum that would actually engage with you about it?
Funny there are people here who listen to my Soundcloud
Smoogie
quote:Originally posted by GrahamC:
Smoogie, go and pi55 off elsewhere you c0ck womble, nobody wants you here talking about hard kicks and hard house. Pi55 off and find some real friends instead of annoying us.
Your are a cu nt of the first degree
In English please?
Vladel
Seriously Smoogie, get a life mate. Everybody hates you and if you get some perverse pleasure out of pissing decent people off then it says more about you than it does us. No one here wants to hear about your ******** and I?d expect your listeners were mostly one time to hear how bad it is. Hell I even listened to a post you linked of the new hard house and it sounded the same as it did in 2002.
You are not going to change anyone?s mind and you?re talking to the wrong crowd or is it the only crowd? Perhaps the folk on hard house forums hate you as much as we do.
Sm00gie
I'm never going to stop trolling you all. Hard House trolling makes me go as hard as a 2 by 4.
I pleasure myself when I think about how annoyed you are all going to be at my silly billy antics.
Smoogie
quote:Originally posted by Sm00gie:
I'm never going to stop trolling you all. Hard House trolling makes me go as hard as a 2 by 4.
I pleasure myself when I think about how annoyed you are all going to be at my silly billy antics.
Oh dear...
Captain Triceps
Haha, I even reported that.
Still though, give it a rest.
Vladel
Reporting it isn?t enough, you need to message silver directly.
Captain Triceps
Just taking the fuckin hint should be enough...
Sm00gie
Hard House all day long
Captain Triceps
Come on, don't be that guy, now.
djDMS
Not much point in a 2nd/fake account that's less annoying than the original...
Smoogie
quote:Originally posted by Sm00gie:
Hard House all day long
Not my account. Silver has been alerted
Vladel
quote:Originally posted by Smoogie:
quote:Originally posted by Sm00gie:
Hard House all day long
Not my account. Silver has been alerted
Just because you created another profile, you think you are clever and pretend your innocence but this thread is full of trolling from your original account. I stand by my opinion that you are in fact not welcome with your nonsense and I would literally celebrate if something bad happened to you because despite people being polite and asking you to cease and desist with the hard house rubbish on this forum which is not hardcore related at all, you have carried on pushing and pushing in the knowledge that Silver won?t do anything about it.
You have been told many times and you don?t quit, I think you know what kind of person you are.
djDMS
Yawn
Triquatra
GrahamC - Stop.
Smoogie - also stop.
Vladel
Back on topic. I think it's pretty much dead now.
djDMS
Thank God Hard house is still going strong and keeping it real!
In other news, I've been listening to loads of harder/faster stuff lately and I'm loving it.
Sefa is my new favourite producer, love his stuff.
Cue Guest in 3....2.....1....
Smoogie
quote:Originally posted by djDMS:
Thank God Hard house is still going strong and keeping it real!
In other news, I've been listening to loads of harder/faster stuff lately and I'm loving it.
Sefa is my new favourite producer, love his stuff.
Cue Guest in 3....2.....1....
Just a heads up, we are not allowed to talk about anything other than Hardcore!
Talking of Hardcore, when is the next Bonkers out?
Vladel
quote:Originally posted by Smoogie:
quote:Originally posted by djDMS:
Thank God Hard house is still going strong and keeping it real!
In other news, I've been listening to loads of harder/faster stuff lately and I'm loving it.
Sefa is my new favourite producer, love his stuff.
Cue Guest in 3....2.....1....
Just a heads up, we are not allowed to talk about anything other than Hardcore!
Talking of Hardcore, when is the next Bonkers out?
The clue is in the sub forum title I.e hardcore
djDMS
Nobody asked you, dickhead.
Smoogie
quote:Originally posted by Vladel:
quote:Originally posted by Smoogie:
quote:Originally posted by djDMS:
Thank God Hard house is still going strong and keeping it real!
In other news, I've been listening to loads of harder/faster stuff lately and I'm loving it.
Sefa is my new favourite producer, love his stuff.
Cue Guest in 3....2.....1....
Just a heads up, we are not allowed to talk about anything other than Hardcore!
Talking of Hardcore, when is the next Bonkers out?
The clue is in the sub forum title I.e hardcore
Cheers for letting me know!
Smoogie
quote:Originally posted by djDMS:
Nobody asked you, dickhead.
Does everyone in Lancashire use personal insults or is it just you?
Oh, sorry, your from Yorks!
Samination
You're*
djDMS
quote:Originally posted by Smoogie:
quote:Originally posted by djDMS:
Nobody asked you, dickhead.
Does everyone in Lancashire use personal insults or is it just you?
Oh, sorry, your from Yorks!
You're lucky I don't care about you enough to dislike you or it would be much worse.
Smoogie
quote:Originally posted by djDMS:
You're lucky I don't care about you enough to dislike you or it would be much worse.
Nice, I go off pretty lightly!
Vladel
I know I don?t follow the gabber scene closely but it seems to me there is a lot more of these soft kicks in tracks. A bit like the joey riot remix of sharkeys awakening on the completionist stuff goes to all that trouble to have this huge buildup and then such a gutless kick drum. The depth seems to have gone and it?s also very prevalent on the newest angerfist album.
djDMS
I don't mind 'softer' kicks in some tracks, gives my poor old ears a rest.
If Gabber or even Frenchcore are toned down slightly and sound a bit more like UK Hardcore I'm all for it.
Yes I know that won't be a popular opinion in Hardcore circles but it suits me!
Smoogie
quote:Originally posted by Vladel:
I know I don?t follow the gabber scene closely but it seems to me there is a lot more of these soft kicks in tracks. A bit like the joey riot remix of sharkeys awakening on the completionist stuff goes to all that trouble to have this huge buildup and then such a gutless kick drum. The depth seems to have gone and it?s also very prevalent on the newest angerfist album.
Softcore Gabber?
Hard2Get
quote:Personally, for me things went sour pretty quick around about 2006
For me as well. It was well established in 2005 already and that's the year i normally mention when i say similar things.
wong
2005_was_the_time
Smoogie
quote:Originally posted by Hard2Get:
quote:Personally, for me things went sour pretty quick around about 2006
For me as well. It was well established in 2005 already and that's the year i normally mention when i say similar things.
The thing is 2005 was the year that the mainstream by Raverbaby and the like got a major push with the CXHC series and a lot of artists started following with very quickly. At the start of the year the Hardcore Heaven and Hardcore Nation compilations got the year off to a good start but most of it was 2004 or older stuff. By the end of the year the style had quickly been regularised as per the mainstream.
If you listen to the stuff from 2002-2004 you can notice the difference as only a smaller number (such as Raverbaby) where doing the more vocal and mainstream stuff but other artists where not afraid to push the boundaries. This can be seen, or at least heard on Bonkers 10 and 11.
In 2005 Freeform was at a good point but it never really went far from the background. This may have not been too much of a problem as it was never meant to be mainstream but I felt that some artists where ignoring the style somewhat. By 2006 the rules had been set and while music wise the scene still saw a large number of releases and event attendance was huge it was by 2008 when things where notably stale.
I remember on this forum people where regarding 2008 as being a make or break year at first but by the end of the year nothing had really progressed as such and by the end of 2009 it all seemed to be over. Hardcore has never really recovered. If anything the better stuff of the last decade was at the start, in the early 2000s and not towards the end.
Smoogie
Take Blinded by Euphony and DJ Storm:
Quite a strong tune and different compared to most of the time. Perhaps it sounds dated now but it would have been ahead of the game. Much more stronger than a lot of the cheesy vocal stuff which was to come
Smoogie
This one by Brisk and Ham is interesting. It has a somewhat similar take to their Stimulant DJs remix of 'A Project - Fantasy' but this is Hardcore. It was sadly never released as far as I know but it has to be one of the finest of Brisk's (and Ham's) works
Impulse_Response
quote:Originally posted by Smoogie:
This one by Brisk and Ham is interesting. It has a somewhat similar take to their Stimulant DJs remix of 'A Project - Fantasy' but this is Hardcore. It was sadly never released as far as I know but it has to be one of the finest of Brisk's (and Ham's) works
quote:Originally posted by Vladel:
I know I don?t follow the gabber scene closely but it seems to me there is a lot more of these soft kicks in tracks. A bit like the joey riot remix of sharkeys awakening on the completionist stuff goes to all that trouble to have this huge buildup and then such a gutless kick drum. The depth seems to have gone and it?s also very prevalent on the newest angerfist album.
Softcore Gabber?
Mate it's not even funny, they have all this build up and the kicks are like tap-tap.
Smoogie
quote:Originally posted by Vladel:
Mate it's not even funny, they have all this build up and the kicks are like tap-tap.
The same thing made UK Hardcore fail. Everything got softer after every new release
The Big Spill
the thing about the hardcore revival back in 2000 was it had the 1998 surge of trance to ride on the back of. Not long after that hard house exploded and the likes of Brisk and Ham were already firmly part of the Tidy Trax stable. Billy Bunter and Jon Doe were driving the Honey Pot label and the hardcore influences were obvious. Before you knew it there was a hardcore area at most hard house events to aid the cross over appeal; support for the sound was massive.
Now hardcore is going through another lull but what is different this time is that there isn't any big wave of similar sound that the nu breed of young people can identify with. Dance music in general seems to have got so much slower and a lot of tracks build into a crescendo of nothing. It's like it's music for the self conscious generation.
I don't think it's all doom and gloom though. More and more people are picking up on hardcore breaks it seems (even Suzuki got in on the act with Sons Of A Loop Da Loop Era) and these things always come round in cycles. For as long there are people like us wanting the hardcore sound then it will exist (Kniteforce is a prime example) and even though the days of piling into the Sanctuary are gone we can at least be thankful that there are still people out there that are passionate for hardcore.
Icewind
I come on here periodically, and I gotta say that this is a sad state of affairs. I remember when I initially got into hardcore somewhere during the mid 2000's trancecore phase, listening to all the bonkers CD's, going to my first events, and starting to dj/produce. It never occurred to me how niche and fragile the scene was back then, and I could have never imagined it coming to this. These forums were also much more active at that time.
I think the problem is that hardcore is trying to appeal to everyone and has spread itself too thin. When I go to a hardcore event, I am expecting to hear hardcore and other rave elements like perhaps jungle/dnb/gabber etc (which is in the same BPM range). When I start hearing a trap section or a Justin Bieber vocal, well, something is wrong. I get that producers are looking to diversify, and find that "new sound" that pushes hardcore and can appeal to fans outside of hardcore but I think it's gone maybe a bit too far now. Hardcore needs to go back to it's roots.
I can say that in Toronto where I live, there is still a small tight knit scene, and there is maybe 1 event every 2 months on average, sometimes more or less depending. People do still come out and dance, but even here it is kind of fading and just barely hanging on. I remember when there used to be an event almost every weekend.
At the end of the day, I am happy that there are still people who care about the state of hardcore. I think hardcore got a bit too big and couldn't sustain itself. Perhaps it's time to start fresh and build the scene back up from scratch and keep it underground where it belongs.
...and I apologize for the self plug but it really is hard to find exposure, so for what it's worth..
Smoogie
quote:Originally posted by The Big Spill:
the thing about the hardcore revival back in 2000 was it had the 1998 surge of trance to ride on the back of. Not long after that hard house exploded and the likes of Brisk and Ham were already firmly part of the Tidy Trax stable. Billy Bunter and Jon Doe were driving the Honey Pot label and the hardcore influences were obvious. Before you knew it there was a hardcore area at most hard house events to aid the cross over appeal; support for the sound was massive.
Now hardcore is going through another lull but what is different this time is that there isn't any big wave of similar sound that the nu breed of young people can identify with. Dance music in general seems to have got so much slower and a lot of tracks build into a crescendo of nothing. It's like it's music for the self conscious generation.
I don't think it's all doom and gloom though. More and more people are picking up on hardcore breaks it seems (even Suzuki got in on the act with Sons Of A Loop Da Loop Era) and these things always come round in cycles. For as long there are people like us wanting the hardcore sound then it will exist (Kniteforce is a prime example) and even though the days of piling into the Sanctuary are gone we can at least be thankful that there are still people out there that are passionate for hardcore.
Well I am not really allowed to talk about Hard House on these forums (on the Hardcore section anyway) but I will add there are some similarities and always have been. Indeed there has been that cross over which you can here as far back as the Tony De Vit days and it is worth mentioning that I have heard one TDV set from 1995 which is surprising as it featured a Dutch Gabber tune right in there.
Indeed Brisk and Ham crossed over with their Stimulant DJs project which sometimes also produced little more than jut Trance. Even Scott Brown dabbled in Trance during the boom at the millennium while Teisto himself had actually started by releasing some Gabber in the mid 90s. Jon The Dentist ha done some Gabber type stuff in the mid 90s before he went Trancy under the Tidy label while Dutch artists DJ Isaac and Paul Elstak have branched outwards a few times as well under different names.
The thing is with a lot of modern EDM is it seems to lack the daring side of what used to be acceptable. The focus seems to be more on drops and funny tricks and less about the energy or rush. Dubstep was awful for that. They could use some good samples and then spoil it by going into the 'wobble'
As for the Hard House 'revival' it is not so much that the style has changed but more so the quality of releases has gotten better. A few guys all of a sudden started out putting good stuff that was not minimal or as techy and have brought the vibe back. Hardcore can do that again with the right mindset and there are examples of varies '90s revivals' such as breakbeat from Kniteforce or the old Dutch Gabber sound from Casketcrusher's Total Destruction label.
If you get a few artists doing something good again then others will follow. It can happen but it is just not happening at the moment
Samination
You're allowed to talk. Just not posting video's and proclaiming them as "the hardcore"
carldj90
Everything I loved about this music has changed. Most new Hardcore feels dated in a week. Maybe it's because everything, not only hardcore, is moving at a rapid pace.
I find it hard to actually want to keep up with most releases these days due to lack of interest. It's really hard when classic UK Hardcore is well written, but not production wise.
Those DJ Seduction releases really intrigue me. Thank you for sharing.
Smoogie
quote:Originally posted by Samination:
You're allowed to talk. Just not posting video's and proclaiming them as "the hardcore"
Well it is harder than Hardcore but rules are rules, eh?
Samination
quote:Originally posted by Smoogie:
quote:Originally posted by Samination:
You're allowed to talk. Just not posting video's and proclaiming them as "the hardcore"
Well it is harder than Hardcore but rules are rules, eh?
just as hard as my cock just now... used and flacid ;)
Smoogie
quote:Originally posted by Samination:
just as hard as my cock just now... used and flacid ;)
wong
quote:Originally posted by Samination:
quote:Originally posted by Smoogie:
quote:Originally posted by Samination:
You're allowed to talk. Just not posting video's and proclaiming them as "the hardcore"
just as hard as my cock just now... used and flacid ;)
sami stop wanking whilst on HHC.COM, warned you about that before
rafferty
Producer wise I think the UK hardcore scene has probably the most advanced productions it has ever had. The scene got in a bit of a rut near the end of the 2000s with everything sounding the same. Every producer looked at raver baby trance and freeform for inspiration.
You just can't keep rehashing the same old thing over and over again with no innovation and expect people to stay interested. People who never evolved just got left behind
The scene now seems to be very influenced by the EDM/House, Electro/trap and the Hardstyle scenes these days. Instead of the old trance from the past.
There is a lot of great talent still producing out there though.
Tweekacore
Minus the crown
Iyf & Nobody
Technikore & JTS
Callum Higby
Macks Wolf
Spyro
Jekyll
Alex Prospect
Andy Wilson
Mike Riverie
Ryan Kore
Spojaz
Entity
Fracus & Darwin
Scott Brown
Klubfille
I could go on forever. There is just a lot more variety in the scene and people who loved the raverbaby years are just nostalgic the same way old people say the 1960s music is better than today.
Maby check out a label called Totally Ardcore if you love the 2000s sounds. Reminds me so much of the older sounds some of you seem to like.
rafferty
quote:Originally posted by Smoogie:
quote:Originally posted by djDMS:
Thank God Hard house is still going strong and keeping it real!
In other news, I've been listening to loads of harder/faster stuff lately and I'm loving it.
Sefa is my new favourite producer, love his stuff.
Cue Guest in 3....2.....1....
Just a heads up, we are not allowed to talk about anything other than Hardcore!
Talking of Hardcore, when is the next Bonkers out?
I heard the new Bonkers will be a Hard House version with Lisa Lashes, Anne Savage & Lisa Pinup all on the front cover with Brisk (Stimulant Djs) as the boss with a cigar.
djDMS
They could call it 'Donkers'
Shouldn't be much chance of Sharkey coming along and spoiling it...
Impulse_Response
quote:Originally posted by rafferty:
Every producer looked at raver baby trance and freeform for inspiration.
The scene now seems to be very influenced by the EDM/House, Electro/trap and the Hardstyle scenes these days. Instead of the old trance from the past.
This is why hardcore sucks now. If you want EDM, maybe find a different scene.
rafferty
quote:Originally posted by Impulse_Response:
quote:Originally posted by rafferty:
Every producer looked at raver baby trance and freeform for inspiration.
The scene now seems to be very influenced by the EDM/House, Electro/trap and the Hardstyle scenes these days. Instead of the old trance from the past.
This is why hardcore sucks now. If you want EDM, maybe find a different scene.
Man the only thing that sux is repeating a dated tance sound over and over again with no innovation. That is the definition of stupidity, a category you seem to fall into. Take a listen to Hardcore Heaven & Bonkers in 97. That is what original Hardcore is. Not what you like. Music will always evolve, whether you like it or not.
If you don't like things changing, maybe you need to find another scene lol..
carldj90
quote:Originally posted by rafferty:
quote:Originally posted by Impulse_Response:
quote:Originally posted by rafferty:
Every producer looked at raver baby trance and freeform for inspiration.
The scene now seems to be very influenced by the EDM/House, Electro/trap and the Hardstyle scenes these days. Instead of the old trance from the past.
This is why hardcore sucks now. If you want EDM, maybe find a different scene.
Man the only thing that sux is repeating a dated tance sound over and over again with no innovation. That is the definition of stupidity, a category you seem to fall into. Take a listen to Hardcore Heaven & Bonkers in 97. That is what original Hardcore is. Not what you like. Music will always evolve, whether you like it or not.
If you don't like things changing, maybe you need to find another scene lol..
Well just saying find another scene is stupid. Saying things like that is exactly why people are complaining haha. Like if you can't find a solution then don't say anything.
There are legit reasons brought up here from some people who have been in the scene for a long while. AND someone posted some new Seduction doing the 97 style 2018 updates so like...the trance sound being repeated isn't stupid and perhaps innovative enough to make the scene thrive on both sides of the sea.
Although, a majority of the forums and posts on this website are just pure insanity and nonsense.
Smoogie
quote:Originally posted by djDMS:
They could call it 'Donkers'
Shouldn't be much chance of Sharkey coming along and spoiling it...
Sy and Unknown tried 'Donkcore' back in 2004:
Smoogie
Was the first Donk actually unintentional and from Rotterdam?
Samination
Advanced production doesn't always mean success. The only reason the likes of Gammer and Darren Styles are getting more success, is because they've branched out to more successful (sorry, I mean more popular) genres, not because their Hardcore has gotten better, production wise.
Ins't the charm with Hardcore is that it should be a little filthy, unprocessed? Even the name Hardcore is implying that it's supposed to be edgy...
wait... did I just confirm that Hard House it more Hardcore than UK Hardcore?`DAMN YOU SMOOGIEE!!!
Triquatra
They've tapped the American market, it's really as simple as that.
Dance music in the UK has been well known, successful, commercial and part of the culture since the early 90s.
There's no longer a wave to ride here, it may have taken the US decades to catch up, but that's clearly where the surf is, now. :P
Impulse_Response
quote:Originally posted by Triquatra:
They've tapped the American market, it's really as simple as that.
People keep saying this and it makes me curious, what styles are popular are in the UK and elsewhere right now?
EDIT: In particular, I remember scrolling through my soundcloud feed full of Japanese producers a while back. It was always a lot of the same EDM garbage.
Samination
Grime, and dirt :P
Triquatra
quote:Originally posted by Impulse_Response:
People keep saying this and it makes me curious, what styles are popular are in the UK and elsewhere right now?
same as always really, most styles of dance music that have been popular since the 90s are still popular; apart from hardcore (haha).
The Annual 2019, from ministry of sound is at the number 2 spot on the UK Top 100 Compilations chart at the moment.
as I say though, this is the way it's always been for kids who were born 1987+ in the UK dance music has just been everywhere for them, they were brought up with it, it was never niche or special.
Hardcore WAS niche and special, that's why when it boomed, it boomed and we had the UK compilation charts littered with hardcore albums...buuuuut that's over.
It appears (from where i'm sitting over here) that the USA are enjoying finally being able to experience something that is so far removed from what their parents brought them up with.
I remember when I lived over there it was like some sort of ultimate sin to "admit" that you listened to dance music "dance music?....oh you mean techno? ****, that shit?!" the USA seem to be a far cry from that now! XD
Besides, It's called EDM now, so that makes it acceptable to listen to ;)
Triquatra
Really interesting to note the amount of callbacks to 1995 house music in that advert.
Interesting.
Impulse_Response
quote:Originally posted by Triquatra:
I remember when I lived over there it was like some sort of ultimate sin to "admit" that you listened to dance music "dance music?....oh you mean techno? ****, that shit?!" the USA seem to be a far cry from that now! XD
Was it really that bad? I remember my parents had a couple of dance albums, including Ultimate Dance Party. My brother and I blasted that when we were kids, especially "I Like To Move It" because we thought that was the most hilarious thing ever. I also combed the shelves at a local music store in college and found all sorts of used dance/trance/house albums from the 90s and early 2000s. I even found a few hardcore albums.
I'm glad electronic styles are popular here, but I still don't like most of what I hear. I tend to prefer pleasant melodies and enjoyable sounds. Maybe I'm just too picky, but most EDM sounds like it's designed to grind on your ears and be as slow as possible.
Triquatra
Comparitively speaking, yes.
Skidzorz
quote:Originally posted by Icewind:
I come on here periodically, and I gotta say that this is a sad state of affairs. I remember when I initially got into hardcore somewhere during the mid 2000's trancecore phase, listening to all the bonkers CD's, going to my first events, and starting to dj/produce. It never occurred to me how niche and fragile the scene was back then, and I could have never imagined it coming to this. These forums were also much more active at that time.
I think the problem is that hardcore is trying to appeal to everyone and has spread itself too thin. When I go to a hardcore event, I am expecting to hear hardcore and other rave elements like perhaps jungle/dnb/gabber etc (which is in the same BPM range). When I start hearing a trap section or a Justin Bieber vocal, well, something is wrong. I get that producers are looking to diversify, and find that "new sound" that pushes hardcore and can appeal to fans outside of hardcore but I think it's gone maybe a bit too far now. Hardcore needs to go back to it's roots.
I can say that in Toronto where I live, there is still a small tight knit scene, and there is maybe 1 event every 2 months on average, sometimes more or less depending. People do still come out and dance, but even here it is kind of fading and just barely hanging on. I remember when there used to be an event almost every weekend.
At the end of the day, I am happy that there are still people who care about the state of hardcore. I think hardcore got a bit too big and couldn't sustain itself. Perhaps it's time to start fresh and build the scene back up from scratch and keep it underground where it belongs.
...and I apologize for the self plug but it really is hard to find exposure, so for what it's worth..
It's because there isn't a new generation of promoters ready to take the reins. Goodfellaz evolved out of Hullaballo, and Daydream/Nocturnal Commisions evolved out of of GF, and with George & Daydream basically finished, and TRR10 in April being Timmy' last event, it doesn't appear like there's a next gen being primed by then to continue things. I'm sure the death of the HC scene as a whole helped, but without any under their wings to continue things it'll die quickly. You don't see as many new comers as you did when I firsst started going up to Toronto in 2011 for the first Heart Of Gold. HoG5 was filled with 24-32 year olds, and I'm sure those numbers will continue to rise as the years go on
jenks
It's a young man's game.
Vladel
Grabber has definitely gone to shit as well. Angerfists latest album and virtually everything on Juno seems to have declared war on bass. The result is horrendous and I really hope this change doesn?t stick.
Bring Me Round To Love
That's why i love the Synthwave/Retrowave scene right now, it's against that horrible modern sound that Hardcore tried and failed at.
djDMS
It's typical that just as I start getting more of a liking for the harder styles, somebody decides to water them down and make the kicks weak and hopeless.
Was listening to some Gabber & Frenchcore in the car earlier and I couldn't even make my one year old granddaughter cry. Pathetic!
Samination
quote:Originally posted by djDMS:
It's typical that just as I start getting more of a liking for the harder styles, somebody decides to water them down and make the kicks weak and hopeless.
Was listening to some Gabber & Frenchcore in the car earlier and I couldn't even make my one year old granddaughter cry. Pathetic!
+1, and I don't even got children :P
djDMS
....unless you include the ones locked in your basement
Samination
quote:Originally posted by djDMS:
....unless you include the ones locked in your basement
Hush, we don't talk about them, nor the raver baby DATs I have in there...
Icewind
quote:Originally posted by Skidzorz:
quote:Originally posted by Icewind:
I come on here periodically, and I gotta say that this is a sad state of affairs. I remember when I initially got into hardcore somewhere during the mid 2000's trancecore phase, listening to all the bonkers CD's, going to my first events, and starting to dj/produce. It never occurred to me how niche and fragile the scene was back then, and I could have never imagined it coming to this. These forums were also much more active at that time.
I think the problem is that hardcore is trying to appeal to everyone and has spread itself too thin. When I go to a hardcore event, I am expecting to hear hardcore and other rave elements like perhaps jungle/dnb/gabber etc (which is in the same BPM range). When I start hearing a trap section or a Justin Bieber vocal, well, something is wrong. I get that producers are looking to diversify, and find that "new sound" that pushes hardcore and can appeal to fans outside of hardcore but I think it's gone maybe a bit too far now. Hardcore needs to go back to it's roots.
I can say that in Toronto where I live, there is still a small tight knit scene, and there is maybe 1 event every 2 months on average, sometimes more or less depending. People do still come out and dance, but even here it is kind of fading and just barely hanging on. I remember when there used to be an event almost every weekend.
At the end of the day, I am happy that there are still people who care about the state of hardcore. I think hardcore got a bit too big and couldn't sustain itself. Perhaps it's time to start fresh and build the scene back up from scratch and keep it underground where it belongs.
...and I apologize for the self plug but it really is hard to find exposure, so for what it's worth..
It's because there isn't a new generation of promoters ready to take the reins. Goodfellaz evolved out of Hullaballo, and Daydream/Nocturnal Commisions evolved out of of GF, and with George & Daydream basically finished, and TRR10 in April being Timmy' last event, it doesn't appear like there's a next gen being primed by then to continue things. I'm sure the death of the HC scene as a whole helped, but without any under their wings to continue things it'll die quickly. You don't see as many new comers as you did when I firsst started going up to Toronto in 2011 for the first Heart Of Gold. HoG5 was filled with 24-32 year olds, and I'm sure those numbers will continue to rise as the years go on
We got a few new guys coming up right now...including myself, spun at tims birthday a week ago, hoping I'll get called out to spin again soon. I would prefer not to sit back and see the scene fade out...if that means learning the ropes on hosting my own parties, then perhaps that's something I should look into. It's okay if there's never going to be hullabaloo size events here anymore, because that was too big to sustain anyways.
d2kx
This post was initially a response for the Technikore appreciation thread, but I am way too ADHD to keep it to a single subject.
I admit I do not like *all* of Technikore's more recent material, but he is still one of the best hardcore producers ever with absolutely unforgettable tracks that I'll never forget the first time listening to.
He recently released his fantastic cover of 4AM on Electric Fox (Tweekacore & Darren Styles' label) with another track coming soon on there, and it was played in Tweekacore's Qlimax set:
(19:27 - the whole set is great btw.)
I kind of hope that he'll cuddle up with DS & Tweekacore some more, keep his future tracks as simple and catchy as 4AM and continue from there. I know that Q-dance has been happy with Darren Styles & Tweekacore at Defqon.1 aswell and can definitely see them adding Technikore or another hardcore producer to the Defqon.1 lineup or their other events in the future.
There are still other great producers out there, and there are also definitely some doors that are open to this kind of music. But just putting stuff on Soundcloud or playing at niche parties (as great as those are) is not something that is of interest to or will get noticed by a brand like Q-dance. They are not gatekeepers, but they need a reason beyond someone working hard in the studio. It's not like a videogame where you earn points and deserve better by just releasing something, somewhere.
But whenever they see something new getting played in a Da Tweekaz/Tweekacore set (Technikore - 4AM), or The Chainsmokers ending Ultra Music Festival with hardcore (Gammer's Ran-D - Zombie remix) or Gareth Emery admiring Hixxy on social media, or how great the response to W&W's collaboration with DS has been (W&W & Darren Styles - Long Way Down), or see someone featured on Dirty Workz/Monstercat (Stonebank/Modulate), they look into it.
The Psytrance scene has been very successful recently, with Vini Vici, Blastoyz, Liquid Soul, Astrix & Ace Ventura being able to work with people from outside the Psy scene, and they didn't have to water down their music either - the music was never the problem, the communication was.
I am convinced more people from the Hardstyle community know that Orbit1 (Audiofreq) and Modulate (Stonebank) have released hardcore tracks to great success lately than people from the Hardcore community even realized when Da Tweekaz started their push into Hardcore last year with Tweekacore. And that is totally fine - but people like Darren Styles are where they are today because they do care about what's happening elsewhere and how that might be relevant to them, and not by "holding down" some obviously glorious bedroom producers or whatever.
If some Hardcore fans & producers would prefer it to stay Underground, so be it. I super disagree and think it fits in just as well at mainstream electronic festivals. That is not a play of words on the HU label btw. - I still like them and have my Hardcore Underground CDs sitting close to me - even though I think it was a mistake to overwork themselves to death, for years now, trying to chase down people like Sharkey or getting those final touches on that Blu-ray or hoping to get support from only within Hardcore, rather than slowing down, relaxing and getting some sanity back and figuring out where there could be a possible match or interest in a collaboration with other innovative labels from other scenes. I know this must have happened before (Wasted Penguinz - Bittersweet remix from Fracus & Darwin is a good example), but they still drain too much of their energy just to deliver those perfect physical products while you can barely find official Hardcore Underground or Fracus & Darwin videos of recent releases on YouTube.
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